Irony
Catholic: "Even without the Bible, societies have always valued marriage."
pro-same-sex-marriage: "societal values change"
Catholic: "Well, what's to keep 4 people from marrying each other?"
pro-same-sex-marriage: "society has always understood marriage to be between two people."
UNBELIEVABLE!!!!!!
ReplyDeletehttp://www.theblaze.com/stories/nancy-pelosi-my-catholic-faith-compels-me-to-support-same-sex-marriage/
They call them Mormons, Didn't they have multiple wives? for a man who is supposed to be so intelligent? You really are Childish.
ReplyDeleteI don't know what your comment means.
DeleteTo help you understand my post - this is a serious response to people who say societal values change. A Catholic question which I've never heard a valid response to yet is this, "if social values change, then what is to keep 3 people from getting married (as some lib profs are already writing about)?" The answer is either a) nothing or b) well, society has always understood marriage to be between two people. If you take b) then it is highly ironic that someone in one sentence would dismiss social values and then in the next sentence promise that they will be upheld and NOT dismissed in other areas.
Quit talking about homosexual people in a bad light. They don't deserve the negativity YOU have given them in the past however many blogs you wrote about them. Why don't you talk about the GOOD homosexual people? Like Fr. Mychal Judge for example. This guy is(in my book) a saint and I refer to him as such.
ReplyDeleteI'm not talking about the PEOPLE in a bad light, I'm talking about the idea that they can be married in a bad light. You're hearing from me what you want to hear
DeleteIf the wiki is accurate, Fr. Judge did uphold his vow of celibacy. This is a good thing.
DeleteBut he also held that Our Lord allowed His Church to teach error and that homosexual sex was morally acceptable. He makes the classic error we see time and time again--that any sexual act is transformed into good by saying the magic word "Love". One might as well say they love shelter, so it is ok to rob people at gunpoint to pay the rent.
All of us are called to chastity. All of us. Heterosexual, homosexual, Catholic, Protestant, atheist, hottentot, and eskimo. Chastity is a beautiful and deep virtue, but since we are building on the rubble of the sexual devolution, we start with the basics: it means that the only place were sexual contact is morally good is between a man and woman married to each other. Anything else is Lust, which will devour you from the inside out. No one has said it would always be easy. But Our Lord's Word is clear: It's not, "Well, as long as you have those gushy feelings of infatuation and arousal that you mistakenly label 'love', I guess I'll give you a pass if it gets too tough." Rather, it is "Pick up your cross and follow". Trust Him rather than the world's If-it-feels-good-do-it prescription for death.
Scott -- I don't see where Fr. Judge held that Our Lord allowed His Church to teach error and that homosexual sex was morally acceptable. I see where he was a member of Dignity USA but I don't know how deeply involved he was with that. I think he simply disagreed with the church's view on homosexuality. He did a lot for homosexuals. He held Mass for AIDS victims, mostly who were homosexual. Of course, that eventually was shut down by the Bishop. Figures. Jesus wouldn't have done that. He also counseled gay people and the parents of gay people. I know he probably bent church rules here and there, but church rules were made by imperfect sinful men and the church is run by humans who are both imperfect and sinful. Btw...your last sentence interested me quite a bit. "Trust Him rather than the world's If-it-feels-good-do-it prescription for death." Are you talking about spiritual death or physical death or both? I find it interesting that there is nowhere in the Bible that it says there are most definitely people in hell. Jesus never said there were people in hell. Nor did he condemn any person or persons down to hell. Does the Church infallibly claim there is at least 1 human soul in hell at the moment? If they do, how do they know that? Where do they get that information? How do they get that information?
ReplyDeleteWell, it depends on what you mean by "simply disagreed with the church's view on homosexuality." If you meant that he disagreed with how the Church ministered to homosexuals, there's no real problem in that the Church has only provided guidance and policy rather than binding teaching. If you mean he thought homosexual acts were not wrong in and of themselves, then that is an error that we can only pray he repented of. The teaching that homosexual sex is an objective grave offense against chstity is infallible by virtue of Sacred Scripture, Sacred Tradition, and the constant teaching of the Church. As far as Jesus not shutting down a Mass for AIDS victims, theat's a pretty tendentious claim in which I think there is more to the story to that. To wit: If in addition to having an AIDS Mass, they were teaching serious error, Our Lord would shut it down, but without more evidence I am obliged to defer to the bishop's judgement. I do know that while there are excellent ministries for homosexuals like Courage, there are also false ones like St. Xavier's in New York (if I recall the name correctly).
ReplyDeleteAs far as Hell, I am aware that there is a popular theory that Hell exists, but that it is empty of humans or human souls. I haven't studied that much, so I won't speculate other than I find it shaky given all the biblical warnings. We do know however, that Hell absolutely DOES exist, anyone who dies in a state of mortal sin goes to Hell, and if one does go to Hell, they remain there for all eternity.
Have you been to hell yet Scott?
DeleteWhat if i told you that this "God" exists due to word of mouth. You only believe in God because your parents taught it to you and they learned it from their parents who learned it from their parents........ who learned it from their parents who learned it from some guy in the desert who realized he could make up magical stories to manipulate people to do what he wanted.
Actually, my parents did not teach it to me. They never baptized me or belonged to a church and in fact, my dad was an Ayn Rand atheist (and still is however, I think he is softening.) and encouraged me to read it it. (I read "We the Living" and didn't really care for it even though I was in my scoffing phase.)
DeleteSo it wasn't until I was an adult when I started studying Christianity and eventually converting.
For future reference, I and Fr. Hollowell (based on what I've read from him) are approachable and reasonable people, so you might want to consider asking instead of assuming next time.
Scott-- true the Bible has warnings in it about hell, but it doesn't mention any human soul being down there. Me personally; I generally believe most of the Bible is true. However, not all of it. I have found a passage in Genesis that was most definitely not true and have tried to have more than one priest explain the discrepancy to me, but overall could not give a good explanation. Plus, I have found in another verse of St. Paul's that contained a word in it that wasn't coined until sometime in the 1800's, thus added to the Bible after it was coined. What the passage said before that word was introduced, I have no idea. Plus, I'm guessing this particular word completely changed the real meaning of what St. Paul originally said. Also, there are some other passages, such as St. Paul raising the dead, miraculously healing the sick, blinding people, etc... who does that sound like? Sounds like Jesus Christ to me. Sounds like St. Paul in his later life ran parallel to that of Jesus. I find it difficult to believe that a sinful non-divine man can raise dead people up. If St. Paul could do that, why couldn't any of the Popes do that? Or anybody else for that matter?
ReplyDeleteWell, there is not much I can do with "Me personally" theologies. Nor would I want to because I don't see what it has to do with the Catholic faith or even the subject at hand. Yes, lots of people come up with their own cobbled version of Christianity. What of it?
Delete